Convicted Felons as Members

[pdrake]

I was just reading a story on Frank Quattrone, the famed internet banker, who was recently convicted in NYC.  It looks like close to 20 months for Mr Q.  It was also mentioned that he is spending quite a lot of time on the links of his various private clubs, Tehama, MPCC, Los Altos to name a few (I have heard he is a member at Cypress too).  This leads me to a quick question.......does a club have the right to boot a member who is convicted of a crime?  Does a private club of the stature of MPCC/Cypress really want this type of bad publicity, having a member who lied and cheated and was convicted?  

[John_Conley]

Just to be clear, Frank Quattrone is an investment banker who rose to prominence when technology and internet stocks took off in the late 90s.

"Internet banker" sounds like the guy from Ditech.com.

[Dave_Miller]

I was just reading a story on Frank Quattrone, the famed internet banker, who was recently convicted in NYC.  It looks like close to 20 months for Mr Q.  It was also mentioned that he is spending quite a lot of time on the links of his various private clubs, Tehama, MPCC, Los Altos to name a few (I have heard he is a member at Cypress too).  This leads me to a quick question.......does a club have the right to boot a member who is convicted of a crime?  Does a private club of the stature of MPCC/Cypress really want this type of bad publicity, having a member who lied and cheated and was convicted?  

Not sure of the legal ramifications of tossing a member out of the club (Doug Wright, Dave Schmidt where are you) but it would probably be up to the individual club.  
Doubt if it is anyone else's business.  Felons can still play golf can't they or are felons just banned from golf as part of their sentence
Best
Dave

[Jfaspen]

I would imagine that most private clubs (and esp some of that stature) would have a clause in the membership agreement stating that if you put the membership or the club in a bad light through your actions, your membership could be revoked.

I think it is alright to do this for the same reasons that Augusta can exclude women.. These are private clubs who do and should have complete control over who is allowed in.

Jeff

[A_Clay_Man]

Who cares if they play golf?

As long as they pay their dues and assesments.

[Brian_Gracely]

Dave,

I think you're missing the real issue here......there might be an opening on the waiting list at CPC......get your application updated ASAP    

[George Pazin]

Personally, I'm scared that a life where the best things in life don't get a rise out of me anymore might not be all it's cracked up to be.  

Now I understand why you would pass up that flight with Salma and crew.

[johnk]

Private clubs are great that way, if you're in, it's hard to kick you out...  Every club I've ever been acquainted with has had a fair share of reprobates, rummies, cheats, etc. of all types: old-money, new-money, trust-funds... so I'd wager that it's likely that *most* private clubs have a convicted felon as a member.

[Brian_Gracely]

Brian:

Let me ask you a serious question:  would you really WANT to be a member at CPC?  Would you really WANT to "get used to" that place?  Can you imagine a life so spoiled when you don't go ga-ga just entering the parking lot, let alone making the walk to 15?

Wow, it's something I never thought of because I knew it would never be something I'd have to lose sleep over.  It all depends on your perspective, but it would be a nice problem to have.  

Here's a couple things that crossed my mind:

One time at MPCC (I think it was on #10 on Dunes), I asked Bob Huntley how long it took him before you stopped getting partially distracted by the scenery while playing.  He told me that he considered himself blessed to be able to wake up each day and have the opportunity to get distracted, and sometimes the distraction was a good cure for a mediocre round.  I assume that same logic could apply to CPC.

My current home course is one of my favorite places in the world, especially at certain times of day (dawn & dusk).  Sure, there are plenty of days when I'm grinding it out for a $2 Nassau and it just becomes another course with 18 holes....my bad for not realizing what's around me.  But it's those days when I have a chance to play 5 holes before nightfall or 8am on Sunday with my brother and we're the only footprints in the dew that I realize I can somewhat appreciate the same "distractions" that Mr.Huntley gets in Monterey.

I'd love to have that problem....  

[Joel_Stewart]

The clause in most clubs bylaws is "conduct unbecoming of a member" which allows a member to get booted.  

Quattrone is not a member of CPC.

[TEPaul]

If somebody asked me if I wanted a convicted felon in my club I'd tell them "Hell yes" if he was great guy. I might even want him more than when he was just like any other old law-abiding good guy!!

We had an interesting situation at our club not long ago with a prospective member, Larry Brown, until he left the 76ers and moved on. The club seemed actually concerned for some odd reason that he was an active professional B-ball coach but I secretly suspect some were concerned he might bring Allan Iverson over to the club with him, like that wouldn't be acceptable.

Somebody on the admissions committee got around to asking me what I thought about this somewhat controversial nomination of Larry Brown and would I want him to be a member?  I told that admissions guy that I didn't know that much about Larry but he looked OK to me with his little wire-rimmed glasses and such and that he'd probably fit right in around here but I, for one, would never agree to support his admission as a member unless he absolutely promised to bring Allen Iverson over to the club with him almost everytime he came.

I said, maybe I could get used to hanging with Larry and maybe I'd even consider playing golf with him if he asked me nicely but that I really wanted to hang with AI and have an opportunity to maybe touch his hair at some point and maybe even play a bunch of golf with him and perhaps even do a little bob and weave with him out on the 4th green or something.

But that admissions guy didn't listen to me---they never really do listen to my great ideas over there.

[JakaB]

At Lawrence County Country Club we have some convicted Felons who are members and I would rather play with them everyday of the week instead of the snitch who turned evidence against them and got off scott free....Snitches and Rats are much worse than a man who has paid his debt to society and his family..

[Mike Nuzzo]

would you really WANT to be a member at CPC?  Would you really WANT to "get used to" that place?  

I hear you saying you would get used to it...do you think we would?  
Maybe that's why some never tire of their own home course?  They each have so much to offer, why not enjoy it every time.
Cheers

P.S.  As it pertains to felons... what Tom Paul says!

[DPL11]

Riviera didn't waste any time kicking OJ to the curb.

[David Wigler]

Brian:

Let me ask you a serious question:  would you really WANT to be a member at CPC?  Would you really WANT to "get used to" that place?  Can you imagine a life so spoiled when you don't go ga-ga just entering the parking lot, let alone making the walk to 15?

Personally, I'm scared that a life where the best things in life don't get a rise out of me anymore might not be all it's cracked up to be.  

On a web site that frequently jumps to insanity, this may be the most insane comment ever.  If CPC ever approaches you with membership and you turn them down, please tell them about your good buddy in Michigan that would gladly take your place!

[Bill Gayne]

Tom,

Shortly after turning pro Allan and his mother bought separate houses in my neighborhood. We had similar reactions from other neighbors that he was going to cause problems and there would be noise, violence, and unruly behavior. I'm not aware of any problems that have occurred. In matter of fact they are rarely home.

The only time I questioned Allan's judgement is shortly after signing his 7 year $70 million deal he was in his mother's front yard with some friends. They were trimming a Leland Cypress tree with a gas powered chain saw.

They have quite the collection of luxury/sport vehicles.

[pdrake]

What about when Iverson dragged his wife outside his house and the whole police dept was there???  Was that considered unruly behavior?

As far as the felon topic, what about a convicted felon joining a new club.  It seems the overriding opinion here is that if he is a good guy and not a snitch, no problem.  I think in the real world, it would be a HUGE problem.  Judges are members at lots of clubs, they cannot be mingling with convicts just for appearance sake, no matter how good the guy.

[Bill Gayne]

I'm not saying Allan is without problems because they are well documented. But for the seven or so years they've  owned the houses by us I haven't seen or heard of any problems in the neighborhood at all.

[SPDB]

I think NOKD is probably equally applicable to a member's (or prospective member's) rap sheet. We'll call it, NOCD.

 

[TEPaul]

"At Lawrence County Country Club we have some convicted Felons who are members and I would rather play with them everyday of the week instead of the snitch who turned evidence against them and got off scott free....Snitches and Rats are much worse than a man who has paid his debt to society and his family.."

JohnB:

That's why you're sort of a one dimensional guy despite all your verbal flair on here and I'm a far more well rounded guy than you.

You see, I'd love to play with those convicted felons like you but unlike you I'd also like to play with the snitches and rats. What I'd like to do best, though, is play with the convicted felon and the rat who snitched on him in the same group. What a trip that would be, don't you think?. I mean how cool would it be if the felon started chasing the snitch around the long par 5 13th green trying to bury his 2 iron in the snitche's skull. That'd be more fun than if we all made eagles!

[frank_D]

.......does a club have the right to boot a member who is convicted of a crime?  

brother P Drake

yes they can control their memebership roster . . . . but some clubs would have few members remaining . . . st andrews in boca FLA comes to my mind . . . . and one more notorious offender was a well recognized clergy prior to conviction ! also leewood country club in eastchester NY had convicted mobsters as members since i can remember and it always made me a little nervous opening the trunks of their big lincolns and cadillacs to get their golf bags . . .but they were great tippers !

[JakaB]

TEPaul,

Recently someone thought it would be funny to pair the snitch and the Felon on the same calcutta team.....the snitch and Felon got so pissed at the guy (not me) who put their names together that they actually almost became close again in their attempts to kick the jokers ass.....btw....I just had a great lunch where we were all telling about the various fights that have happened and not happened at the Goat (LCCC)....The one good thing about having a number of Felons around is that if you catch them packing you can send them back up the river.....but thats when you need the snitch in your corner.

[rgkeller]

I recently saw a convicted felon and the snitch who testified against him playing at Deepdale, but not together.

[John_Cullum]

Riviera didn't waste any time kicking OJ to the curb.

And he's never been found guilty of a felony.

[SPDB]

I recently saw a convicted felon and the snitch who testified against him playing at Deepdale, but not together.

You forgot to add that the snitch is also a felon, and a helluva golfer...much better than the snitchee.  They are both members, too, which would illustrate that perhaps a rap sheet does not make one persona non grata...certainly not at Deepdale. It might even get you a better spot on the buffet line.