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Tommy_Naccarato

Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« on: August 30, 2004, 04:06:58 PM »


The following aerial was taken in 1949 and the course itself have been recently or is actually undergoing restoration as we speak.

First things first....try to identify the style of architecture and whose it might be!

Then we'll post a more modern picture of the course and then some clues and see if it helps out some more.

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2004, 04:14:40 PM »
I am guess it is a Raynor or Banks course due to the angled and linear nature of the bunkering. 17(?) appears to be a short hole.
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Brian_Gracely

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2004, 04:20:23 PM »
Looks like there is a Short (top), Redan (bottom) and Road (middle).  

Scott_Burroughs

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2004, 04:32:37 PM »
I'm pretty sure the restoration is done here, finished last year, I think.

Previously, it was a regular AOTD.

"Personally introduced to Ms. Wongluekiet"

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2004, 05:06:11 PM »
Got it! A few minutes of searching the Final AOTD Summary gave me the answer. I'll throw in another clue:
is this near where you might "kick it up a notch"
« Last Edit: August 30, 2004, 05:07:15 PM by JNC_Lyon »
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Tommy_Naccarato

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2004, 05:06:31 PM »
Some good guesses so far, but one of them is definitely wrong. I'll let you guys figure which guess it is thats wrong.

"Nothing like good ol' Southern Home Cookin'!"

Doug Braunsdorf

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2004, 05:09:07 PM »
Metairie?
"Never approach a bull from the front, a horse from the rear, or a fool from any direction."

Scott_Burroughs

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2004, 05:19:01 PM »
is this near where you might "kick it up a notch"

Let's see, he tapes his show in NY...so where in the Big Apple
area is this?   ;)   or is that La Grande Pomme....

ed_getka

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2004, 05:21:12 PM »
JNC,
  How do you know what hole is #17? ???
"Perimeter-weighted fairways", The best euphemism for containment mounding I've ever heard.

JNC Lyon

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2004, 05:21:21 PM »
Scott_Burroughs:

I was referring more to the style of the show rather than where it is taped.

ed_getka:

I followed the routing. It is th eigth hole on one of the nines. Judging by the general flow the course, I assumed the par three in the upper left, the one which I was referring to, is 17.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2004, 05:25:13 PM by JNC_Lyon »
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Scott_Burroughs

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2004, 05:28:29 PM »
Scott_Burroughs:

I was referring more to the style of the show rather than where it is taped.

I know.  The wink showed that I was playing on your clue.  He became famous in this town (area) with two restaurants, now more have opened in different parts of the county.  The French reference also clued things in.


Ed,

You can check scorecards of courses on golfcourse.com to check routings and match yardages with that.  It might be 17 or not, I didn't check.

ed_getka

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2004, 05:38:30 PM »
Scott,
  Too much work. :)
"Perimeter-weighted fairways", The best euphemism for containment mounding I've ever heard.

A_Clay_Man

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2004, 05:38:56 PM »
You guys speak gobbeldyguk.  I'll guess RTJ sr.

JNC Lyon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2004, 05:45:39 PM »
OOPS! Silly me!  :P
"That's why Oscar can't see that!" - Philip E. "Timmy" Thomas

Tommy_Naccarato

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2004, 05:46:39 PM »
Ed, I thought you were into golf course architecture? You mean to tell me you can't figure out the routing?

Yes, the Road Hole is #17, and I'm sure a bayoo isn't to far away either!


Tommy_Naccarato

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2004, 05:56:25 PM »
Here is the modern day aerial with the hole names:



« Last Edit: August 30, 2004, 06:04:36 PM by Tommy_Naccarato »

A_Clay_Man

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2004, 06:28:00 PM »
ok so it looks better now.  c.b?

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2004, 06:52:58 PM »
I think Metairie is the answer after reading this from cybergolf.com. Doug was first:

Metairie Club Being Restored as ‘Tour 18 of 1922’
By: Mark Leslie
Dealing with the notorious drainage of Louisiana's delta as well as lost character of their Seth Raynor-designed golf course, members of Metairie Country Club are witnessing the restoration of their club's grand heritage. "We looked at what we were and what we needed to be for the 21st century," said golf director Greg Core. "We're landlocked, so we can't stretch the course to 7,000 yards. And when we celebrated our 75th anniversary in 1997, we were reconnected to the fact that the roots of this golf course were with Raynor and the Classical Era."  
 
The members' awakening led them to engage Ron Forse, a leading historical restoration architect, to "bring Metairie back to its luster of the 1920s," Core said. Under Forse's guidance, Metairie CC will become what course superintendent Gary McCulla Jr. calls "The Tour 18 of 1922" – a reference to the Texas course which has replicated 18 famous golf holes. Construction began in January 2003 and the course is expected to reopen on September 1.  
 
Raynor, who had a dazzling career from 1908 to 1926 as an understudy and then a partner of the famed C.B. Macdonald, was known for his recreation of famous golf holes from around the world. According to Forse, Metairie's layout includes at least two holes each from St. Andrews Old Course in Scotland, The National Golf Links and Shinnecock Hills Golf Club on Long Island, and Piping Rock Club in New York, as well as four from Nassau Country Club in New York.  
 
"We have worked on, or studied, every one of these courses," Forse said. "A 1951 aerial photo of the whole course, plus old newspaper articles from the 1920s, tell us how many holes from what golf courses Raynor took, but they don't tell us which holes they are here at Metairie. Nevertheless, while the routing is much the same as it was in 1922, the features are totally different. Old plateau greens sites have been moved, bunkers have been removed and trees have grown up."  
 
Raynor created clay models of all the green sites, and a local man, Joe Bartholomew, oversaw construction of the project. Though "no semblance of Raynor remains," Forse said, "we will restore his strategic principles and features to this land."  
 
"Some of that restoration," Core added, "is being done with modern equipment in mind. Bunkers 140 yards out in the fairways do not affect golfers today. Prior to this restoration, you could hit your biggest, baddest Big Bertha off every tee and not worry about where you'd land. Ron's work – adding 30 bunkers and rebuilding the greens – will cause people to think about hitting a 2- or 3-iron off some of the tees."  
 
Meanwhile, the course’s poor drainage is being addressed as well. "Because the back nine is 2 feet above sea level and parts of the front nine are 2 feet below, drainage is crucial. Yet it was nonfunctional in a lot of areas," said McCulla, a Metairie native who returned home after several years at Barton Creek Resort in Austin, Texas. "An average 68 inches of rain a year and heavy, heavy clays exacerbate the problem. When it rains for a period of time, you can forget about playing golf for a week."  
 
To rectify the situation, golf course contractor Wadsworth Golf Construction is "capping" much of the property with a layer of sand and installing a massive drainage system.  
 
The greens, built on what Core called "pushed-up muck," are being rebuilt to USGA specifications, minus peat. Peat is being replaced by a ceramic product, Perm-O-Pour, which retains water until the turfgrass roots need to absorb it. McCulla is overseeing sprigging of Tifdwarf Bermudagrass greens, Tifsport fairways and tees, and 419 Bermudagrass roughs. Grassing will be done in six-hole increments, he said, with the first six beginning in mid-April, the next in late-April or early May, and the third six before the end of May.  
 
What has been the response to the project by Metairie's members, who include Freddie Haas, the man who defeated Byron Nelson to break Nelson's PGA Tour winning streak at 12 in a row? "The course had never ever been closed," said general manager Don Beaver Jr. "But we overcame objections by buying tee times at five area courses. That has worked out much better than what we thought.

"Meanwhile, we may be the only club in history that has actually grown a membership while we were closed,” added Beaver. “We marketed it, and made it well known what we were doing, and that the initiation fees will go up. And we have had marvelous results."

"Plus," concluded Forse, "that entire membership will be able to play whenever they want now, and when they step up on that first tee they will be playing a resurrected Raynor, gently tweaked for today's game."
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2004, 07:19:50 PM »
I think the Road Hole bunker that is supposed to approximate the challenge of the road looks better in the old pic, and should be restored accordingly.

Patrick_Mucci

Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2004, 07:29:30 PM »
SPDB,

Could the same be said of the "short" hole bunkering ?

JNagle

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Re:Extreme Aerial Of The Day
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2004, 09:52:30 AM »
SPDB.

The Road Hole was restored to its full extent considering surrounding features that were non-existent in 1949.  Greens have been shifted, tees, new practice green and cart path were also added.  It would be great to see "Road" bunker in-place it simply did not work from an elevation and drainage stand-point.

Pat,

As for the "Short" hole - the 1949 hole is not an original.  There was another par 3 crammed into the site that was eliminated some time ago.  Although the "short" is an obvious feature of Raynor we had to keep in mind foot traffic and maintenance.  The forced carry with surrounding deep bunkers still provides much the same challenges as the 1949 hole.
It's not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or the doer of deeds could have done better.  The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; .....  "The Critic"