Selective tee usage.

[Chris Perry]

You know the old adage that you should play the tees suited for your level of ability/handicap, but what if your the kind of player who hits the ball well enough that most holes on the course won't give you much trouble except for the really long par 3's and 4's?

Is it ok to play the tips on holes you are comfortable with and move up on holes that are too intimidating from back there, or is it mandatory to pick a color and stick with it the whole round even if it makes 4 holes more playable but the rest of the course seem too short?

Case in point:I'm going to go play Nicklaus North tomorrow, and theres a par 4 on the front thats 465 that I'd rather play from the Blues, (430) and most of the par 3's range from 185 to 225 all with small greens and water in play, which can be rather taxing on you after awhile, and honestly on 12 and 17 I'd rather play the WHITES because they are still 168/188 from those tees.

I mean who wants to have to pull out 3 irons all day just to clear hazards?

So is mix and matching OK or strictly taboo?

[Steve_ Shaffer]

Chris

Interesting question. On a recent trip to AZ, I was paired with someone from MN who suggested that we play the "German tees." I didn't ask the derivation of this term but to him it meant playing the par 3s and 5s from the blues and the par4s from the whites. I had no problem in doing this. I think it should be done more often. In my case, I will do it if there's a gap in yardage from blues and whites. For example, if the blues are at 6700y and the whites are at 6000y, then I will mix tees and eliminate the longer par4s to reduce the total yardage to somewhere in between. I know some private clubs do this    and have the "mixed" course sloped and rated for posting purposes.

Steve

[Bill_McBride]

The 9th and 18th at Cuscowilla are both very long par 4s, and #10 has a bear of a carry across the lake to the fairway.  To make it fun for the higher handicapper, there is a layout which is par 73(?) where 9 and 18 are par 5's and #10 (and #4 which also has a forced carry over a lake) play from front tees.  So this creates a formal mixing of tees which can be a lot of fun for higher handicappers.

[Dale_McCallon]

Chris,

I don't see how you can worry about this being taboo?  I mean if this is the way you want to play the course do it.  You are the one paying the green fees (I assume), so play the course you will most enjoy.  I switch tees up all the time. One day I might play all the long par 4s back, but the par 3s from the front and vice versa.  I don't ever post scores for handicapping purposes, so I really don't worry about slope/yardage.  Just go out and have fun from whatever tees you want.

[Mike_Trenham]

I want to do this all the time on the road, but usually my playing partners look at me like I am crazy.  

Had thought there was a quick way to make an adjustment and adhere to the USGA Handicap System but I reviewed my handbook and there is not a simple conversion.

There should be a simple way to prorate the difference in slope/course ratings.  Wouldn't this encourage more play and ensure that scores get posted both stated goals of the USGA.

[johnk]

I believe that on the Shore Course at MPCC, many members
play a composite set of tees - for example, playing the back tees
except for #7 and #9 (which are quite arduous from the backs).  On the Dunes, I think a lot of people play the back tee on #14 most of the time - because its so cool.

I think they even may have ratings for some of the combinations
on the posting computer.

[Chris Perry]

Good responses guys.

By "taboo", I mean looked down upon by "purists". I agree I don't really keep a handicap either (I just tell everyone it's my swing and what's between my ears, hehe) so I'm not too worried about it.

And for the record, I stuck with the blues again except for 17 because that hole is just ridiculous to play from 200 yards out. I hit a 5 iron from the whites at 185 and still slashed it into the lake  anyways. The two guys I was playing with SHOULD have played the whites on 12 because they failed to get over the water about 3 times before giving up. Ouch.  

And I took 30 more strokes than Shigeki's course record of 62.  

[Brian_Gracely]

Chris,

Keep a few simple things in mind:

1) If you can't make par from the tees your playing at, you ought to move up until you can.  

2) Time spent stroking your ego from back tees and then looking for lost balls is time someone behind you is frustrated waiting for you.

3) Don't make any claims, or keep them limited, about your handicap if you play a mixed set of tees that doesn't have a defined rating (ie. MPCC Dunes with back tees on #11 & #14)

4) Have fun...life's too short and the game is inherently too hard not to  

[A.G._Crockett]

As John K. says, there are a number of courses now (both public and private) which combine the first two sets of tees into what is often called the "player's course."  The appropriate tee is denoted on the scorecard and slope and course ratings are provided.  

In addition to providing a legitimate course (without much stigma) that is suited to low to mid handicap golfers that don't want to play a 7000+ yd. course, it strikes me as a relatively economical way to offer more to the clientele.

[JohnV]

Had thought there was a quick way to make an adjustment and adhere to the USGA Handicap System but I reviewed my handbook and there is not a simple conversion.

There should be a simple way to prorate the difference in slope/course ratings.  Wouldn't this encourage more play and ensure that scores get posted both stated goals of the USGA.

Mike,
There is a simple way.  Go to this page: USGA Handicap Site

Click on the 2002-2005 Handicap Manual which will popup a new window.  Click on Section 5 and scroll down to 5-2g.  You will find tables for men and women on how to adjust the Course Rating and Slope based on the difference in yardage from the tees you played vs the rated tees.

As an example, if you played a set of tees that was 145 yards shorter than the rated set, you would subract 0.7 from the Course Rating and 2 from the Slope.

[Chris Perry]

Chris,

Keep a few simple things in mind:

1) If you can't make par from the tees your playing at, you ought to move up until you can.  

2) Time spent stroking your ego from back tees and then looking for lost balls is time someone behind you is frustrated waiting for you.

3) Don't make any claims, or keep them limited, about your handicap if you play a mixed set of tees that doesn't have a defined rating (ie. MPCC Dunes with back tees on #11 & #14)

4) Have fun...life's too short and the game is inherently too hard not to  

Two things with this, do you mean par for the specific hole, or par for the whole course?

If the latter, then I wouldn't even be able to play the ladies tee, I'd have to drop it at the 150 marker and count it as the first shot on every hole, then you might see me go around in 70, but that's not really playing golf now is it, especially if I paid $100 to play the course in question.

Two, I can lose balls just as easily from the ladies tees as I can from the blues or tips. Sometimes moreso because it makes hazards farther down the fairway come into play more.

That said, I generally stay away from the tips because they are rated for 0-6 Handicaps, which I am far from being, as are the guys I usually play with. The point I was getting at, is sometimes there are holes that are only 160-180, 360-380 and 500-520 from the tips and fully managable for a guy who hits it 280 off the tee, but then you get those 460-80 yard par 4s, 600 yard par 5's and 225 yard par 3's that designers like to throw in for some reason (I'm of the philosophy that holes shouldn't be 225 yards long unless they are extremely downhilll, and shouldn't be water laden either) that should be avoided by the less than competent player, and you should move up on those particular holes and play back on the others that you can instead of sticking to some regimented plan that the course's scorecard dictates for you.

[Mike_Trenham]

Mike,
There is a simple way.  Go to this page: USGA Handicap Site

Click on the 2002-2005 Handicap Manual which will popup a new window.  Click on Section 5 and scroll down to 5-2g.  You will find tables for men and women on how to adjust the Course Rating and Slope based on the difference in yardage from the tees you played vs the rated tees.

As an example, if you played a set of tees that was 145 yards shorter than the rated set, you would subract 0.7 from the Course Rating and 2 from the Slope.

John

Thanks, thought they told us this at the USGA Handicap seminar I attended in 2003.  Should have kept looking.

[cary lichtenstein]

Both me and my wife do this all the time. We go back if the hole seems to set up to short and up if I'm the back tees if it is out of reach.

Where I play regularry, our guy group play 9 holes all the way back and 9 on the 2nd set of tees. The courses was rated and sloped for us so we can turn in scores from those sets of tees. This makes the course 6850, which is about as long as 2 of us can handle. The other 2 guys can play it all the way back if they want, but it is way too much for us.

I hit is about 230 plus roll, so I get anywhere around 245 to 265 depending on the fairway roll, but with a strong wind in my face and soft fairway, a 425 yard hole can turn into a drive and a 3 wood.

[BrianMcL]

Hawktree in Bismark, ND makes it easy to play the length course you want,  with thier mix and match approach.

http://www.hawktree.com/CourseInfo/YardageSystem.htm

[Doug Siebert]

Chris,

Keep a few simple things in mind:

1) If you can't make par from the tees your playing at, you ought to move up until you can.  

I don't think I agree with this one -- at least if you are talking about par for 18 holes rather than par for that particular hole.  If we did things that way, architects could pretty much drop to two sets of tees, front and tips.  The front would be where the women's tees are, where 99.8% of golfers would play from, and the tips would be where the tips are now, where all the plus handicaps would play from.  Sure would slow play when I had to wait for the green to clear on half the par 4s!

My personal feeling is that the tees you play should be based mainly on the length of your usual approach shots on par 4s, which neatly brings the issue of consistency etc. into it rather than the "I can hit it 290 for the 1 out of 20 I hit square and straight so I should play from the back" attitude.

So if you find you are playing mostly wedges, move back.  If you find you are playing woods or having to lay up very often, move up.  Otherwise you are fine.  So long as they keep up, I don't care if a 120 shooter wants to play from the tips.  If they want to torture themselves, that's not my problem.

[Dan Herrmann]

Our course, French Creek, is rated for Championship, Men's and a great combination of the two.  Same for Men's/Men's short tees.

There's a 240 yard carry that I can't do, but I like playing the tips occasionally.  Our Gold/Blue course, rated in the GHIN computer, solves that problem for us.

The GHIN program actually makes this relatively straightforward for the hdcp chair/pro, and I recommend it.