spanish bay v spyglass

[peter_mcknight]

I'm going up to the Monterey Peninsula in July and am presented with the option of playing either Spanish Bay or Spyglass.  I only get to choose one of the two. Unfortunately for me, Pebble and Cypress aren't an option here!

What I'm wondering is, if you guys had the same choice, what would you choose and why.  I read some of the thread on Spanish Bay holes 15 and 17 already and it seems that the general consensus is that Spanish Bay isn't all that.

I'd appreciate any and all opinion rather quickly because a decision needs to be made here.

[A_Clay_Man]

Peter- If you'd like I'd be happy to guide you, but first, you should tell us about your preferences?

If you'd like to just go ahead and book Spy, most visitors to the peninsula prefer it. If the first five holes doesn't float your boat, the back 13 will.

Most people have had very limited exposure to spanish bay. They react harshly to the esa's and the thoughts of what could've been. Having been around that course over 75+ times, I have been exposed to many of it's idiosycracies I think it is a special place. It may not have the same kind of magic, as it's neighbors but for a course with more names on it's lineage than most law firms, it don't suck. If your into the visuals, Spanish may be the ticket with the widest ocean view, of any starting hole, I know of..

[ed_getka]

Peter,
  Neither of those courses are worth the money they charge. I would go to Pasatiempo 1 hour north for half the price. However, if its a freebie then I would choose Spyglass, as long as you are relatively proficient off the tee. The first five holes nearer the water and dunes are the best of the course in my book. #1 is a long par 5 downhill to an island green (surrounded by sand). #2 is a short par 4, with an uphill approach. #3 is a short downhill par 3 right at the water, with glorious views. ***Note that there is a horse trail in the sand behind and to the left of #3 green. After your round follow this horse trail up from 17 mile drive and after about 800 yards of slogging through the sand you will see #8 Cypress Point down below you on your right. You can see about 5-6 other holes from up there on the trail. Now back to Spy, #4 is the much talked about shortish par 4, into a narrow little green that will tie your brain in knots trying to figure out how to get near the pin. #5 is a solid straightforward par 3 to a well bunkered green. Then you head up into the woods which I can't remember much of, but it is decent golf, just not my cup of tea.
  I would say Spanish Bay is a little more fun, but is even less worth the money they charge.
  In case you are wondering, I would say Spy is worth $125, and Spanish Bay about $75.
   Pebble is a better "value" on the monterey peninsula, if you are paying full freight, and as slow as they are these days, I don't think you should have too much trouble getting on, unless you are a foursome.
   Have a good trip.

[Lance Rieber]

Peter,
Played both courses(Spanish in the State Am and Spyglass in the Nor-Cal Am) Spanish has a lot of fun golf holes but Spyglass to me is the better course.  Spanish Bay seems to me to have some forced holes on the property.  I am not sure if they had a free rein on the land or were told where to build the holes(Watson and Tatum). Spyglass is just a honest to goodness tough golf course.  I think the first five are good but the rest of the course is strong also.  I don't remember alot about Spanish except for the green on the back with the top-hat in the middle. No hole really stands out to me. Like Adam said the course does have some wonderful views and is fun to play but the better course is Spyglass IMO.

[Chris Perry]

I'd say they are apples and oranges.

Spanish IS more wide open, but I found there were also far more places to lose balls with my errant shotmaking. (FYI Spyglass was the course I shot the lowest round on because I hit it fairly well that day, and go figure it's ranked the toughest in the state).

For me the best value on my trip WAS Spyglass, but that is because I played at Twilight for $160, there was NOBODY around, they let me go out 30 min early AND gave me a free cart to boot. Ahhh customer service!!    

[A_Clay_Man]

I've never done match play. It was quite the rage when I first started reading threads here. so here goes
SHvSB

#1 Both 3 shotters - Spy 1 up The green site wins this one hands down

#2 Both short two shotters. Close but- Spy 2 up

#3 This is hard! I love SB's but it does have some serious flaws with the cart path at the dogleg I'll call it halved.

#4 Spy wins this one 3 up

#5 SB's #1 hndcp hole wins SB down 2

#6 SB makes you think, Spy is just a tough green SB down 1

#7 SB wins All Square

#8 SPy 1 up

#9 Spy 2 up

#10 Spy up 3
 
#11 Up 4

#12 Goes to SB by a hair, SB 3 down

#13 Sb 2 dwn

#14 Close but SB wins, SB 1 down

#15 SB All Square

#16 Spy gets it on lore alone but the one shotter at SB had one of my favorite bunkers on the left. No longer natural looking. SPy Up 1

#17 Halved

#18 SB wins (even with the condos) Match all square after 18

#19 SB wins the match. There is no bar, save for the members, at Spy. The bar at SB makes the Windsock lounge look like a four stool dump, with a picture window.

A lot of tough calls. I knew which holes were my favorites, based on my game, but I did try to be objective, on the quality of the golf hole. Be it how much it makes YOU think or feel.

[Philip Gawith]

at risk of oversimplifying, spyglass is the adult course, spanish bay the one with broader, more family appeal. i say that as one who played spanish bay twice and enjoyed it hugely - a great visual course and some wonderful dunes. IMO it is the more scenic of the two courses. spyglass is considerably longer and if you like hitting long iron seconds to par fours, on top of your best drive, then it is the course for you! if you are looking for upliftment, go to spanish bay. if you are looking for a stern challenge, visit spyglass.

[Paul Richards]

spyglass hill wins this game, set and match

[Jonathan Cummings]

I agree with Paul but what Adam posts gives me pause.  I have played Spyglass a half dozen times and Spanish once.  I dismissed Spanish as noise in a sea of harmony (PB, SG, CP, MPCC).  Maybe I need to see it more as Adam suggests before I dismiss it.

JC

[A_Clay_Man]

JC- Your dapperness is only exceeded by your openness of mind. Thank You

Speaking of Openness, SB has it,as mentioned, but it doesn't have the width. It has less shot testing situations than Spy,and perhaps that's why I prefer it.

I've been wondering for a long-time what Spy would be like if all those trees were felled?

[tlavin]

Spyglass for golf and design, Spanny Bay for photos and walk in the oceanside park.  Play 'em both and you won't be disappointed.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Spyglass is one of the great courses anywhere. Spanish Bay is a very good course. It is Spyglass hands down if for no other reason than to play number 4.

[johnk]

I'd play Spyglass.

If you wanted to save a bit of money, find a local NCGA member at Poppy Hills, and play there.

(It's a family affair - since the Jones representation is complete on the Peninsula, Sr, Jr and Rees all have courses or major redesigns.)

[THuckaby2]

Peter:

Spyglass gets PLENTY of play - it's the #2 tourist course, behind Pebble.  Don't count on a fast round.  Oh, you might get lucky... but 7/17 being a Saturday, I doubt it.

As for Pasa, well... it's not THAT clear-cut as to its superiority!  Oh, among the cognoscenti here, it's a no-brainer - but this group does tend to prefer older, more strategic, etc.  Ask 100 golfers outside this group which course they prefer between Spyglass and Pasa, and I'd bet at least 75 say Spyglass, just due to the holes on the sand dunes.

On Spyglass v. Spanish Bay, I think TLavin nailed it.  It's all based on what your preferences are.  Spanish Bay is very pretty, more "linksy" overall, and is a better "walk in the park".  Spyglass is tougher and a better design overall.  

You won't be disappointed by either, that is unless you have to pay and money means something to you!  Ed Getka is right on that account.  But, we all have our thresholds.

TH

[THuckaby2]

redanman:

In terms of value for money, good lord is that not even close.  It's PG by a mile.

Taking money out of the equation, well... I'll leave that to Adam Clayman.

TH

[A_Clay_Man]

Peter- I infer, your being offered, means a freebie? If so, Please, do yourself a favor and reserve and take a caddie. The greens at Spy are an impossibilty, the first time through,(or your tenth). And remember, when you leave the 18th, with a huge smile on your face, caddies are not wait staff. 20% will not cut-it, if he/she was good-great. Fair to midland o.k.. Less than courteous, go in and tell the shop, of your experience. Remember, when you over-pay for stuff, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Especially true on the peninsula. Why do you think they do all that ass-kisssing?

[W.H. Cosgrove]

Adam says most people can't get by the Enviromentally sensitve areas......count me in that group.  

I find them aggravating nearly every where I see thembut add the wind at Spanish Bay and I simply can't abide.  

Spyglass is the better choice!

[cdharris]

I played both these courses a couple of years ago on a trip to Carmel.  My favorite was Spyglass.  Too much of Spanish Bay was just long and straight.  It pretends to be a links course but is not. With the lush fairways and rough, just try to run a shot on the green from 40 or 50 yards out.  Also, we played Spyglasss very early in  the morning, one of the first tee times, and played in 3 hours (with cart).  Not having to wait every hole probably helped make it more enjoyable.

[ed_getka]

Normally I would recommend Pacific Grove, but I was there on Tuesday last week and it is as far from links golf as it could be. The fairway grass was over an inch high in a lot of places, so it was not as fun as usual. Especially after having come back from Scotland recently.

[A_Clay_Man]

Ed- That was all I ever wanted from the slush fund, better turf. Now, I want better turf,no...no.. I want better turf and a new 18th hole. NOT A NEW 3.5  MILLION $ MONUMENT TO THE GUY WHO SHOULD BE CUTTING THE GRASS.

[ed_getka]

Adam,
 I was looking at the building that is there now last week, and it is puzzling to me why they want to spend 3.5M on something that I really doubt will get more use than the structure that already exists. There are certainly better ways to spend that money.
   At least they spent some money expanding the bunker to the front left of #3 green, and have made the hole more interesting, adding to the already challenging preexisting green.

[A_Clay_Man]

Peter- Leave your self open to get both in. This time of year Spyglass is a steal. That's daylight stealing.

If you time it right, you couuld golf both, and not have anyone in front of you.

Worth a try

[ed_getka]

Peter,
  Have fun and definitely post your thoughts after you get back. I would love to join you, but I have played both of those courses, and at their price point I won't ever be going back.
   Where do you live now? I gather from the soccer reference that you were in the UK once upon a time.

[Gerry B]

spyglass wins with a 3rd round knockout

agree with the pasitiempo option as well

[A_Clay_Man]

Doi !

Just responding to the fast greens thread, I had a severe and profound realization.
Spyglass Wins !

First face knock-out.  The greens the greens.