[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I have generally agreed with most of our posts regarding the British have a better understanding of how to play the game. Our 4.5 to 6 hours rounds and focus on score etc are difficult to defend. However, I do enjoy just playing a few holes at slow pace and sometimes playing 2 or 3 balls at a time late in the day. I like to sit around a green at my home club and chip for 20 minutes sometimes. The 4th at Spyglass and the 15th and 17th at Cypress are places that I have hit balls to and chiped and putted around for an hour or two until sunset numerous times.  I have never seen that side of the game in the UK. It may exist but I have not seen it. There are somethings about golf in the US that are desirable. I am glad that is available to me here at my club.

[John_Conley]

I'm not a fan of golf cars, but they are great if you have an empty course and just a little time in the evening to play 9.  Before I got married I'd get a truck and try to play 36 by myself between 4:00 and 8:30 pm.  I doubt I would have enjoyed walking 18 as much in the Florida summer heat.

[Andy Levett]

I do enjoy just playing a few holes at slow pace and sometimes playing 2 or 3 balls at a time late in the day. I like to sit around a green at my home club and chip for 20 minutes sometimes... I have never seen that side of the game in the UK. It may exist but I have not seen it.

We do that  too. It's probably not so obvious at the marquee courses that are busy May-Sept but many of those have second 9s or 18s for members to do whatever they like on.
If not those who can afford it just stump up another £450pa or whatever to play at a second, quieter, course.

[Bill Gayne]

Overall, I think that the practice facilities at American golf courses are better.

I also think that this contributes to part of the difference in attitude between golf in America and the British Isles. In America, young people learn the game at practice facilities, going out with parents at the end of the day, and TV. Eventually they go out on their own at munis with their buddies.

Based on limited observation of the British Isles it is learned by caddying, pitch and putts, and playing with parents/family.

[Bob_Huntley]

It is a wonder to me that the golfers in Britain could compete at all, in events such as the Walker Cup etc. The practice facilities at the most prestigious clubs were non-existent or primitive at best. Things have changed for the better in the last twenty years, although I would serve a fatwah on those responsible for mutilating the Eden for that awful thing that they erected at St. Andrews.

[Adam_F_Collins]

Anyone know what the per capita numbers are for golfers to golf courses for USA and Britain?

Are our courses under more or less pressure?

[Alfie]

Tiger,

An excellent question which deserves to be addressed by every golfer of every nationality !

IMO (and experience) the American golfer deserves great credit..... hell - adulation, for the way in which he / she approaches golf in many aspects.

Your (US) general appreciation of golf's heritage is second to none and your spirit and enthusiasm is, to say the least - absolutely marvellous ! I really mean that !

Yes - you're all bloody crazy when it comes down to visiting "The Home" by trying to fit in too many courses instead of slowing down a little and really enjoying the experience. (without causing slow play, of course)
I also apportion some blame to the US for shaping golf over fifty years, or so, to the present state of affairs. But that's hardly been a fault of the average golfer.

BTW, I wouldn't advise pitching and putting around any single green in Scotland - you'll get hunted for your life !!!! But I know exactly what you're saying.

We all get things wrong and that's not a failing. But when we fail to try and right the wrongs we've done. Then that's criminal ! IMO

Americans can stand proud for many of their contributions to golf - and sit down to some others ? As can we in the UK !

And I'll continue to admire the wisdom of people like Geoff Shack and TEPaul from this side of the pond.... without agreeing on everything they say ?

You Yanks are OK (most of the time)

Alfie Ward.

[Rick Shefchik]

Now I can admit it. Last May my wife and I took over five hours to play Pebble Beach -- and not because we were being delayed by the group ahead of us.

It was an overcast Sunday morning with a forecast of rain, and the twosome that was supposed to be paired with us never showed up (probably some corporate stooges who weren't paying for the round anyway, so chose to sleep in after a wild Saturday night. Just guessing.)

I'd taken a caddy two days earlier, so for this round my wife and I simply teed off alone and played at a leisurely pace, since there was no one pushing us -- in fact, no one ever got within a hole of us after we putted out on #2.

When the rains began to fall on #5, the course seemed to empty out, even though it never rained heavily. By the 7th tee the rain had blown through and conditions moderated nicely -- though there didn't seem to be anyone else around to enjoy it.

This was an incredible opportunity that I wasn't about to squander. We kept up a good pace through the Cliffs of Doom, but when we reached the 11th green, I realized we really had the course to ourselves, so we spent about ten minutes hitting chips and putts to the middle hole location on 11 -- a green that I'd seen countless players make a mess of on TV, especially during Opens.

From then on, we hit putts and chips from a variety of locations on every green except 18. It was especially fun on #14, where the pin was cut just over the left front bunker, and on #17, where the pin was far left. I got to try Watson's chip shot and I also got to try a couple of putts across the ridge from the right half of the green to the left.

I still can't believe this opportunity fell in our laps -- it was like having the run of Fenway Park or the Boston Garden for a couple of hours.

No one ever caught up to us -- if they had, of course we would have moved right along. But it would have been idiotic to pass up the chance to play -- and I mean really play, in the child's sense of the word -- on that magnificent landscape.

I can't remember ever enjoying a round of golf more than I enjoyed that one, primarily because we had time to savor every step.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Rick, Now thats what i am talking about. Obviously i do not play that way as a regular diet, but it is glorious fun when the opportunity exists. I am glad you stoped and smelled the roses at one of the great places on earth. I sometimes walk  around TOC in the late hours to savor it as well and wish I could play a few short game shots that one has time to visualize when the world is turning at a slower pace than a traditional round allows for.

[Lynn_Shackelford]

Read Bernard Darwin's "A Second Visit to America" 1928.

There is a difference in style, for the American golfers have now a very distinct style of their own.  And a most graceful and serviceable one it is, with a certain lithe movement of the hips and a reliance on the swing rather than the hit as its two most obvious features."........He goes on to talk about different terms and we have different courses in America.
"That they are keener than we are admits of no doubt.  Be they good, bad or indifferent players, they are keener to improve themselves......They take more lessons; they practice more.  A friend of mine, who has been much in America, made what I thought an astute observation on this point.  When the Briton goes out to practice, he said, he stops when he has hit some good shots.  The American, on the other hand, regards that as the moment to go on practicing, in order, so to speak , to nail down the improvment to the counter and keep it."
Tiger I think you have a bit of both Brit and Yank in you.  Did I say Yank?

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Lynn, I will take that as a compliment. lol Although Yank is a tough name to swallow in "these here parts".

[Dan Kelly]

Now I can admit it. Last May my wife and I took over five hours to play Pebble Beach -- and not because we were being delayed by the group ahead of us.

I did exactly the same thing -- though without your wife (or mine, or anyone else's). Recorded an official 82, but must have taken a hundred other shots on and around the greens. And was never approached from behind.

Am I the only person here who's played Pebble Beach as a single, early -- very early -- on a beautiful, sunny morning, with only the birds for company?

What a treat.

I called from the Twin Cities, a week or two before my wife and I would be visiting Carmel-by-the-Sea. It was June of 1986 -- the week of the Open at Shinnecock. She was writing a travel piece about Carmel, and then we'd be driving down to see some friends in Manhattan Beach.

Got someone in the pro shop. Asked if there were any tee times available, as early in the morning as possible, for the day we'd be there.

"Yes, sir," the woman said. I was on for 6:30 a.m. She asked for my name. I gave it to her. Neat, clean, simple.

I showed up at about 6 that morning. Went into the pro shop.

"Your name?" the guy said.  

"Kelly," I said.

"And has the rest of your foursome arrived?"

"The rest of my foursome? There's no rest-of-my-foursome. I'm a single."

He proceeded to tell me that only foursomes could reserve tee-times. I proceeded to recount the story of my phone call -- and how she'd never asked how many people were in my party, and had never told me that a foursome was necessary.

He said, more or less: Oh, what the hell. If you're willing to play alone, go on out there!

Willing? This is what I'm sure my face looked like:  

He said I would be required to take either a caddie or a cart. I told him I preferred a caddie. He said it was too early; none of the caddies had yet arrived. So a cart it had to be -- the only blemish on an otherwise-perfect morning. I would liked to have strolled down the middle of those fairways ... before wandering off into the rough to find my ball.

So off I went, all by myself, and taking my sweet time all the way.

Very sweet time.

[Pete Buczkowski]

Rick:

My wife and I had a very similar experience playing at Pinehurst.  It was a beautiful Feb. day - had an open time in front of us and the twosome we were paired with did not show.  The foursome behind was quite slow, so we took our time and hit numerous chips & putts after holing out on each hole.  I really wouldn't trade that experience for anything; it makes me envious of the members who can go out on the course in the evenings and get that experience whenever they please.

[Philip Gawith]

when i joined my club in england - huntercombe -  the letter from the secretary said at the end of the FIRST paragraph that i, of course, was aware that members like to play their rounds in 2 hours and 45 minutes! i think in part this is because the course has a foursomes tradition, and foursomes is even faster than 2-ball pace. but since the course is quite short, and green-tee distances are small, this is actually possible if you are not looking for balls, though i tend to find my average round is closer to 3 hours. in my book there is no doubt that this is a blessing. that said, you can have too much of a good thing and my memory of playing at, say, muirfield, is that getting round the golf course quickly can seem to matter more than the golf itself.

as for americans having it all wrong: certainly not! i have loved all my golf in the US. but it is certainly differrent. small things strike you: almost all clubs give away tees (still unusual in UK) and hence people don't pick them up. also, people in the US don't seem to look for balls. at one or two courses i played just walking anywhere near the rough was like a treasure hunt with lost balls just staring you in the face. the mulligan culture is also different with people who hit an errant drive just reloading immediately and firing it off - not waiting for the others to drive off first.

overall, UK golf facilities are much less expansive than their US counterparts - in terms of size of clubhouses, pro-shops, driving ranges etc. partly it is cultural, partly it is just space and age - clubs built on a smaller scale which can't now be enlarged (just like london roads and the underground!)

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Phillip, You may have hit upon something here. The yanks as we are called have a certain individuality that seems to be missing in the UK. I cannot imagine having my club saying you can only play 4 somes on weekends or in the afternoon period. I get upset when our club says no 2 balls or singles until after lunch on saturdays. That may get to the core and what I was really aiming at in the post. I do not think most american clubs have the pressure of conforming to rules of play or type of matches. The comments about different ways to enjoy playing the game were aimed at that. It would take alot away from my enjoyment of the game if I could not just goof around the course late in the day trying different types of shots on the course is much more fun than on the practice tee.

[JakaB]

Pete and Dan,

Is hitting multiple shots off of one green fee an american thing...when growing up...the pro always taught me to never take a practice swing on a tee and never hit more than one shot to a green....it respects the course and the people who will play it some day behind you.    There are few things I hate more than cluster divots and multiple ball marks....but it is not your course and you payed a lot of money...so what the hell.

[A_Clay_Man]

Dan- Do you remember the person who told you "cart or caddie"? By any chance did he have a slight southern drawl?

1986 at Pebble was a different world. The person who's mostly responsible for the changes started as a customer service (cart kid) right around then.

[Philip Gawith]

tiger - like you, i like to play my own ball (maybe that's because i grew up in south africa!) i suppose i should have added that traditional english courses not only play a lot of foursomes, but they play a lot of matchplay and that also speeds things up. obviously the quick golf ethic also relates in part to the weather, so no reason why yankees who enjoy fine conditions need to conform to the same approach! i think in this regard, golfers over here have made a virtue out of necessity. in south africa, which also enjoys fine weather, the halfway-house (anathema to traditionalists) is a very strong tradition, especially for early starters, with everybody stopping mid-round for a 15 minute, high-calorie breakfast.

[Dan Kelly]

Is hitting multiple shots off of one green fee an american thing...when growing up...the pro always taught me to never take a practice swing on a tee and never hit more than one shot to a green....it respects the course and the people who will play it some day behind you.    There are few things I hate more than cluster divots and multiple ball marks....but it is not your course and you payed a lot of money...so what the hell.

John --

I have no idea if "hitting multiple shots off of one green fee" is "an American thing." But...

Did I say I hit multiple shots to greens, leaving cluster divots and producing multiple ball marks? No, I did not.

Did I hit multiple shots to greens, leaving cluster divots and producing multiple ball marks? No, I did not.

Have I *ever* hit multiple shots to greens, leaving cluster divots (repaired) and producing multiple ball marks (repaired)? Yes, I have.

You haven't? I salute you, Mr. Din.

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