John Duncan Dunn

[T_MacWood]

Should JD Dunn be better known?

He collaborated with Travis at Ekwanok and a few other courses that are normally credited solely to WT. He must have had a significant influence on the Old Man. He did the first nine at Hardelot and Hilversumse--two of the more important early courses in Europe. He did the first nine at Quaker Ridge. And in the 1920's he was was involved in a number of major projects in California....his influence in California may be under appreciated.

[Sean_Tully]

Tom
Funny, I was going to start the same thread on him but obviously focusing on his work in CA. My research on him has turned up alot more courses than he has been given credit for, new courses and rebuilds abound. (Using the Architects of Golf as a reference point)

Tahquitz at Hemet,   John Duncan Dunn
Harold Bell Wright CC  in El Centro
Cave Landing Golf Links   in  San Luis Obisbo
Laurelmont in     Oakland
Shore Acres       So Cal coast
Acacia CC     San Dimas
Sunset Canyon CC     Burbank    (new 9)
Thousand Oaks CC        beyond Calabasas
Encino CC   (new 18)
Golfers Club at Calabasas.

I am not familiar enough with the area to know anything beyond what I read. Some more interesting things I found was a layout for  El Sereno, does this course still exist and do they have this information already? A picture of Dunn with the Golf Pro and Chisholm at El Sereno. But, the kicker for me was that Caves Landing Golf Links in SLO, he was to design the course in collaboration with  GC Thomas and Peter Cooper Pryce. Was this course ever built and if so what influence would they have had on each other?

All the while he was still working at some different degrees as an instructor. In 1928 i have him taking the golf pro position at LA Commercial Club, so he was working all the angles.  He played with a baseball grip and in an article written by him he said in as few words that the overlapping grip was a fad. Whooops!

Tully

[Lynn_Shackelford]

Sounds like most of his courses were fads.  They seem to be NLE.  I think Travis sent him out to built nine holes for the City of Pasadena in the early 20's.  I don't know for sure, but I don't think Billy Bell's design at Brookside included any of Dunn's holes.

[Allan Long]

You can also add Catalina Island GC to his list of work in Southern California.

On a national level, he may be under appreciated for his work in So. Cal. But, I think those who were not aware of his work
are those geographically removed from that particular section
of the country and therefore do not see his influence.

[Allan Long]

Lynn--Fads may be a harsh word. There are many courses from that time period lost for numerous reasons.

Royal Palms, Fox Hills, Baldwin Hills, Hollywood and California all from that time period NLE. Dunn's work may not measure up to some of the other work around that period in So. Cal., but I tend to think it wasn't the courses--rather the times.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Allan,

Catalina may not have been his after all. At least Billy Bell was responsible for the course that we know of today, and actually had another 9 routed out but it never got built.

El Serreno was doomed from almost the start.  Located right behind what is now LA County-USC General Hospital, the course got built, but quickly was doomed when costly construction of the clubhouse doomed the entire facility. I'm not even sure if they ever got it open, and if they did, it wasn't for very long.

Los Serranos-North is the only work that I know of that is still existing close to JDD form. In fact, I think he my have had something to do even with the South course there as he had 18 holes routed for the South, but it was built sometime later.

Rio Hondo used to be a lot of fun to play, in fact it still isn't a bad course, just nothing like the original which from experience had a propensity of bunkers everywhere. I remember walking in a lot of these old, left for dead grassy hollows when I first started playing many years ago.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Dunn had either immigrated or spent his winters here in LA in the late 1800's. He married a L.A. socialite and they moved to New York, but it wasn't but for a few years later he set-up offices in downtown L.A. where he had what seemed to be an indoor driving range for executives, along with his design offices.

[Allan Long]

Tommy--Are you saying Dunn never worked at Catalina, or that the course today doesn't resemble his work? I had always understood that he was the one who upgraded the original 3-hole facility.

As far as Bell, I didn't know that he had any involvement. That is why I bow to your knowledge.  

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Dunn may have been the one that built the original three hole facility, and may have built the original nine. But it was Bell who turned the facility into a "all-grass" one and Wrigley was so impressed that he hired Bell to build a course on his estate in Chicago. I think this may have been Billy Bell's one and only course West of Arizona.

[Lynn_Shackelford]

RE: Catalina

Whoever did Catalina, there are some great bunkers still there.

[Sean_Tully]

Lynn
May 1927 Bell started to do some work on the course rebuilding and adding some length. I have seen a photo of the 5th green from around that time period and the bunkers are Bells. To collaborate Tommys comments above there was a picture of Mr Wrigley swinging for the fences from the first tee. Their was a caption to the photo where he was very happy with the work that was done there.

[Tommy_Naccarato]

Lynn, Well, at least there used to be. I hear the great Perry Dye has left his mark at Old Avalon.

[DMoriarty]

As Lynn notes, John Duncan Dunn may have done a routing at Brookside in the early to mid 20's, but I am not sure if it was for Travis.  

The Pasadena press reported that Travis himself walked the property and did a routing, and in usual architect grandeur, called the property the finest for golf on the entire West Coast.   He also tried to sell the city on his process for building sand greens.   Eventually the city informed him that they could not use the routing because of the need to build a road across some of the land.   It would be interesting to know whether Billy Bell took a look at this plan before designing the No. 1 course a few years later.  

[Tommy_Naccarato]

If anyone could probaby considered the Father of Golf in Southern California, it arguably be John Duncan Dunn.

From the late teens to the mid to late 20's, he was a teacher, architect and even writer on the game of golf. He taught Babe Zaharias how to play golf at Cloverfield Golf Course (note to Craig Disher, yes it was famous for for something!) opened not just one but several indoor and outdoor practice facilites in the Greater Los Angeles area.

Also found several courses that I never knew he was affiliated with, as well as never even knew they existed.

-Western Avernue-Former home of the L.A. Open
-Supelveda CC-Which boasted to have copied the famed "Cliff Hole" from Biarritz, France. Further research found that this course once existed in Bel Air and was eventually built by Billy Bell with JDD being retained as head professional, even though he was still designing golf courses at the time.
-Parkridge CC in Corona, which I suspect may or may not be the current Cresta Verde, that was once credited to Randolph Scott as the designer.
and a slew of others.

All in all, JDD is a much forgotten man in SoCal golf, and thats unfortunate, because he may have been responsible for its growth.

[Allan Long]

Tommy--One I haven't seen mentioned that I believe is also Dunn's work is Santa Ana CC. Maybe you can shed more light?

[Sven Nilsen]

In searching for a comprehensive list of John Duncan Dunn courses, I stumbled on this thread which probably sets forth the best snapshot of his work in California.  Although I wouldn't go as far as to say Dunn was responsible for the growth of the game in CA, he was certainly a key player during its boom.

C&W gives us a short list of Dunn projects, which includes:

Atascadero CC (1927, NLE)
Catalina GC (1925)
Idyllwild CC
Lake Elsinore GC (NLE)
Lake Norconian C (1928, NLE)
Los Serranos Lakes CC (North Cse 1925)
Parkridge CC
Peter Pan CC (NLE)
Rio Hondo CC
Santa Ana CC (1924)
Woodvista GC (fka Brockway GC) (9 1924)

This list is far from complete, but as updated and combined with the additional courses added below (several of which were mentioned in this thread), it demonstrates a tremendous amount of design activity in a relatively short period of time.

1919

Unnamed Whittier Course (Whittier) - Sept. 26, 1919 San Francisco Chronicle notes Dunn writing he had laid out a 6,000 yard course in Whittier.

Wilshire CC (Los Angeles) - Sept. 26, 1919 San Francisco Chronicle notes Dunn writing he was to superintend work on the course.




1920

Tahquitz GC (Hemet)


1922

Brookside Municipal GC aka Pasadena Municipal GC (Pasadena) - Along with Walter Travis, prepared a preliminary routing for the course in the Arroyo Seco before project eventually went to William Bell Sr.  Dunn's work began here in 1919.

Nov. 9, 1923 Los Angeles Times -



Lake Tahoe CC (Lake Tahoe)

Western Avenue GC (Los Angeles)

March 12, 1922 Los Angeles Times -



Coyote Pass Project (Los Angeles) - Oct. 8, 1922 Los Angeles Times notes plans for three public courses to be built by Dunn between Los Angeles and Pasadena.  No evidence project ever came to pass.  Possible that this was in reference to the Pasadena Municipal project.




1923

Santa Ana CC (Santa Ana)

Sept. 25, 1923 Santa Ana Register -



Woodvista GC fka Brockway CC (Brockway)


1924

Big Bear Lake G&CC aka Bear Valley CC (Pine Knot)

Lake Elsinore GC (Los Angeles)

Parkridge CC (Corona)

Dec. 10, 1924 Los Angeles Times -



Rio Hondo CC (Downey)

Sept. 22, 1924 Los Angeles Times -



Woodland Hills CC fka San Fernando Valley CC fka Girard G&CC (Woodland Hills)

La Quinta Country and Golf Club (Santa Susana) - June 1, 1924 Los Angeles Times notes Dunn engaged to build the course.  No evidence course was ever built.



Los Serranos Lakes CC (North) (Chino) - Also remodeled parts of the course in 1927.

Feb. 10, 1924 Los Angeles Times -



March 27, 1927 Los Angeles Times -



Sepulveda CC (Los Angeles) - Dunn was originally hired to design the 18 hole course before the contract went to William Bell Sr.

July 22, 1924 Los Angeles Times -




1925

El Merrie Del CC (Sunlands)

May 10, 1925 Los Angeles Times -



Fairmede GC (Oakland)

Dec. 14, 1924 Oakland Tribune -



Idyllwild CC (Idyllwild)

June 14, 1925 Los Angeles Times -



Mayberry G&CC (Whittier)

May 6, 1925 Los Angeles Times -



Santa Catalina Island GC (Catalina Island)

Glendora Golf Course (Glendora) - May 26, 1925 Los Angeles Times notes plans for Dunn to build a course in Glendora.  No evidence course was ever built.




1926

Acacia CC fka Temple CC (San Dimas)

Atascadero CC (Atascadero)

June 28, 1927 Los Angeles Times -



Black Jack Island GC (Catalina Island)

Dana Point Yacht and CC (Los Angeles)

March 19, 1925 Santa Ana Register -



El Sereno CC (Los Angeles/NLE)

Aug. 8, 1926 Los Angeles Times -



Briar Cliff CC (San Fernando Valley) - Oct. 17, 1926 Los Angeles Times notes course being laid out by Dunn.  No evidence course was ever opened.



Shoreacres Club (Mexico) - June 6, 1926 Los Angeles Times notes Dunn designed and laid out two courses, which were located on the beach 20 miles south of San Diego.




1927

Baywood CC fka Laurolawn CC (Hayward)

Oct. 8, 1927 Hayward Daily Review -



Cave Landing CC (Pismo Beach) - Planned to be a George Thomas, Peter Cooper Bryce, Alister MacKenzie collaboration.  No evidence course was ever built.

Jan. 30, 1927 Los Angeles Times -



Gleneagles GC (Pierson Ranch)

May 15, 1927 Los Angeles Times -



Golfers' CC (Calabasas)

May 1, 1927 Los Angeles Times -




1928

Lake Norconian Club (Norco/NLE) - 18 hole course.

Aug. 4, 1928 Santa Ana Register -




1929

Brae Mar Public GC (Santa Monica/NLE) - 18 hole Par 3 Course

June 30, 1929 Los Angeles Times -



New Course at Big Bear Lake (Big Bear Valley) - March 9, 1929 San Bernardino Sun reported plans for a new course to be laid out by Dunn.  No evidence course was ever built.




Date Unknown

Peter Pan CC - Course was located at Big Bear, not sure which Big Bear course (1924 or 1929) this one was.

[Sven Nilsen]

Looking over Dunn's body of work in California, and specifically around Los Angeles, it is hard to overlook how many of these courses are now NLE's.  As noted earlier in the thread, there were quite a few very well regarded courses from the '20's that failed to make it much longer.  But Dunn's percentage seems higher than most.


Its hard to exactly pin down why this was.  I suspect its due to the type of project Dunn took on, or perhaps, more accurately, was able to procure.  For a short time in the early '20's it seems like he, along with William Watson, was the go-to-guy (with a slight hiccup thrown in from Fowler).  But something changed, notably the increase in the profile of William Bell Sr.  There are a few projects in the list above that started as Dunn contracts before eventually being built by Bell, and the same thing happened with Watson being replaced by Bell elsewhere.  For Watson the timing seems to coincide neatly with the Griffith Park project being taken on by George Thomas under the premise that Thomas (with Bell doing his on the ground work) would produce a more playable course than would Watson.  In any case, the amount of work Dunn and Watson were receiving around Los Angeles started to severely slow down towards the end of the decade.


Bell's rise to prominence in his own right seems to have been at least partially due to his promotion by Thomas, Behr, MacBeth and others. He was the new kid on the block, yet he very quickly rose to the position of most highly sought after before too long.  Whether this was due to his own merits as a designer, the swaying influence of more highly regarded players or even a small bit of homerism (I tend to think the Los Angeles set thought of Bell as their own), or more likely a combination thereof, the one time design apprentice was receiving a good portion of the most highly sought after projects in the Southland.


Dunn, in particular, seems to have had an tendency to take on the ill-fated real estate play course.  Many of the projects above were massive developments, with the golf course being ubiquitously present to attract buyers.  The plight of many of these projects is laid out in the back pages of this site (and oddly mirrored in a lot of what we are seeing today).  Often the land the course was on was swallowed up for more houses, or the project itself suffered from over-ambitious goals or a bit of poor timing. 


There is certainly more to the story, especially when you start to look at a course like Lake Norconian, which by all accounts was a prize contract to garner.  But with the rise of Bell, the arrival of MacKenzie and the emergence of Robert Hunter, it seems like the senior statesmen of California design got shuffled to the back of the deck.

[Tommy Naccarato]

Red=NEVER BUILT
Green=BUILT
Blue=BUILT BY SOMEONE ELSE
Black Bold=I DON'T KNOW

Atascadero CC (1927, NLE)Catalina GC (1925) Original layout and then remodel; Sand greens. WP Bell Remodeled for WrigleyIdyllwild CC NLELake Elsinore GC (NLE)Lake Norconian C (1928, NLE)Los Serranos Lakes CC (North Cse 1925)Parkridge CC NLE (On partial site of Cresta Verde Golf Course)Peter Pan CC (NLE) (Was near the marina. 9 holes)Rio Hondo CC Remodeled (Destroyed) by Gerald PirklSanta Ana CC (1924) Course NLE. Recently remodeled/Rerouted by Jay BlasiWoodvista GC (fka Brockway GC) (9 1924)
1919Unnamed Whittier Course (Whittier) - Sept. 26, 1919 San Francisco Chronicle notes Dunn writing he had laid out a 6,000 yard course in Whittier.  (Never Built. It was supposed to be near Pellisir Dairy Farm)Wilshire CC (Los Angeles) - Sept. 26, 1919 San Francisco Chronicle notes Dunn writing he was to superintend work on the course. (Never happened)Lake Tahoe CC (Lake Tahoe) Built. Possibly on Edgewood Tahoe SiteWestern Avenue GC (Los Angeles)(NLE) Course didn't last long and a new course eventually built some distance down on Western and 120thMarch 12, 1922 Los Angeles Times -


Coyote Pass Project (Los Angeles) - Oct. 8, 1922 Los Angeles Times notes plans for three public courses to be built by Dunn between Los Angeles and Pasadena.  No evidence project ever came to pass.  Possible that this was in reference to the Pasadena Municipal project. Never Built


1924Big Bear Lake G&CC aka Bear Valley CC (Pine Knot)  Still ExistingLake Elsinore GC (Los Angeles) NLEWoodland Hills CC fka San Fernando Valley CC fka Girard G&CC (Woodland Hills)  William Park Bell DesignLa Quinta Country and Golf Club (Santa Susana) - June 1, 1924 Los Angeles Times notes Dunn engaged to build the course.  No evidence course was ever built. William Park Bell built the Santa Susana Club


Sepulveda CC (Los Angeles) - Dunn was originally hired to design the 18 hole course before the contract went to William Bell Sr.


1926Acacia CC fka Temple CC (San Dimas) Built, but not sure on designerAtascadero CC (Atascadero) (Watson gets credit for this one as well)Black Jack Island GC (Catalina Island)NLE 9 Holes located at Catalina Island Boy Scout CampDana Point Yacht and CC (Los Angeles)NLE Was on the bluff of Dana Point El Sereno CC (Los Angeles)NLE and did not last long. Much like Sepulveda, plenty of newspaper accounts, no evidence of course)Briar Cliff CC (San Fernando Valley) - Oct. 17, 1926 Los Angeles Times notes course being laid out by Dunn.  No evidence course was ever opened.


Shoreacres Club (Mexico) - June 6, 1926 Los Angeles Times notes Dunn designed and laid out two courses, which were located on the beach 20 miles south of San Diego.


1927Baywood CC fka Laurolawn CC (Hayward)Cave Landing CC (Pismo Beach)  Never builtGleneagles GC (Pierson Ranch)Golfers' CC (Calabasas)NLE 18, possibly 36 holes1928Lake Norconian Club (Norco) (NLE)1929Brae Mar Public GC - Par 3 Course (Santa Monica) New Course at Big Bear Lake (Big Bear Valley) - March 9, 1929 San Bernardino Sun reported plans for a new course to be laid out by Dunn.  No evidence course was ever built.

[Tommy Naccarato]

Looking over Dunn's body of work in California, and specifically around Los Angeles, it is hard to overlook how many of these courses are now NLE's.  As noted earlier in the thread, there were quite a few very well regarded courses from the '20's that failed to make it much longer.  But Dunn's percentage seems higher than most.


Its hard to exactly pin down why this was.  I suspect its due to the type of project Dunn took on, or perhaps, more accurately, was able to procure.  For a short time in the early '20's it seems like he, along with William Watson, was the go-to-guy (with a slight hiccup thrown in from Fowler).  But something changed, notably the increase in the profile of William Bell Sr.  There are a few projects in the list above that started as Dunn contracts before eventually being built by Bell, and the same thing happened with Watson being replaced by Bell elsewhere.  For Watson the timing seems to coincide neatly with the Griffith Park project being taken on by George Thomas under the premise that Thomas (with Bell doing his on the ground work) would produce a more playable course than would Watson.  In any case, the amount of work Dunn and Watson were receiving around Los Angeles started to severely slow down towards the end of the decade.


Bell's rise to prominence in his own right seems to have been at least partially due to his promotion by Thomas, Behr, MacBeth and others. He was the new kid on the block, yet he very quickly rose to the position of most highly sought after before too long.  Whether this was due to his own merits as a designer, the swaying influence of more highly regarded players or even a small bit of homerism (I tend to think the Los Angeles set thought of Bell as their own), or more likely a combination thereof, the one time design apprentice was receiving a good portion of the most highly sought after projects in the Southland.


Dunn, in particular, seems to have had an tendency to take on the ill-fated real estate play course.  Many of the projects above were massive developments, with the golf course being ubiquitously present to attract buyers.  The plight of many of these projects is laid out in the back pages of this site (and oddly mirrored in a lot of what we are seeing today).  Often the land the course was on was swallowed up for more houses, or the project itself suffered from over-ambitious goals or a bit of poor timing. 


There is certainly more to the story, especially when you start to look at a course like Lake Norconian, which by all accounts was a prize contract to garner.  But with the rise of Bell, the arrival of MacKenzie and the emergence of Robert Hunter, it seems like the senior statesmen of California design got shuffled to the back of the deck.

JDD married Gaylord Wilshire's daughter Nora and the family was quite eccentric.  Dunn was very much into owning his own indoor schools for golf which also sold equipment, much like William Watson & wife. At one point, he moved back to New York with his wife, then came back again.  Eventually, he died an elder and respected statesmen for golf here in SoCal, famous for his schools, teaching books and equipment sales.

[archie_struthers]

 


Hey Tommy , hope all is well. So nice of you to drop in !

[Bret Lawrence]

Here are a few early articles on John Duncan Dunn from 1896 and 1897:


The Sun-August 03, 1896:


The Sun-October 10, 1896:


The Sun-March 22, 1897:



The Sun-June 09, 1897:

[Bret Lawrence]

Here are a few JDD articles from 1899:


The N.Y. Times-January 29, 1899:



The Sun-January 17, 1899:




The Sun-May 17, 1899:


The Sun-June 20, 1899:


The Sun-August 08, 1899:


The Sun-August 11, 1899:

[Bret Lawrence]

1900 articles:
As Tommy mentioned in his last post, John Duncan Dunn was married to Nora Wilshire:

The Sun-February 19, 1900:


Brooklyn Daily Eagle-August 05, 1900:



The Sun-October 23, 1900:



Finally an advertisement found in several golf publications throughout 1900 and 1901:

[Sven Nilsen]

Tommy:

A couple of follow up articles on some of your highlights:

Atascadero CC - 9 holes built and opened in 1927.

June 28, 1927 Los Angeles Times -



La Quinta CC/Santa Susana CC - From the following articles, it sounds like these were two separate projects with different organizers.  I have seen no evidence that Santa Susana, like La Quinta, was ever built.

June 1, 1924 Los Angeles Times -



Nov. 16, 1924 Los Angeles Times -

[Bret Lawrence]

The Harper's Official Golf Guide 1900 notes John Duncan Dunn in a few instances.  There may be more in there, but here are two examples:
Tampa, FL




New Britain, CT-  Today there is a course known as Indian Hill CC on the same property, but it has been reworked a few times since 1899.