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CHrisB

Can you identify one of the world's great par 4's?
« on: February 25, 2003, 05:47:30 PM »
This is truly one of the world's great natural par 4's.  It also has one of the great names in golf (it is named after the water feature that comes into play so prominently on the tee shot).  Can you identify it and its name?  Those who have played it can you comment on the hole and the course?

423 yards, with an intimidating tee shot that dictates the strategy of the hole.  A drive down the dangerous right side must clear the burn and stay above the escarpment on the right for a clear 2nd shot into the green.  The "safer" drive left must still clear the burn but the fairway target is wider and flatter.  From this angle, however, the approach is blind over a giant gorse-covered dune.  The fairway swings around the dune, up and through a well-bunkered valley to a slightly raised green.  I played this hole in wind and rain and it was one of the scariest tee shots I've ever encountered!

Here's the hole in 1909 at the course opening.  Looks just as scary then as it does now.  Extra credit if you can identify the gentleman about to tee off!  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:02 PM by -1 »

Bill_McBride

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2003, 05:54:09 PM »
I think it's the "Suez" hole but I thought that was a par 5 and I forget which Open rota course it's located on!   ::)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

CHrisB

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2003, 06:00:21 PM »
Bill,
You are thinking of the par-5 14th at Royal St. George's, with the Suez crossing the hole and OB right.  Good thought, though.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:02 PM by -1 »

Jim_Kennedy

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2003, 06:14:53 PM »
Chris,
I happen to have a friend over who has traveled to Scotland on many a golf trip and he says this is the 7th at Murcar called "Serpentine". Could the golfer in the photo be the designer, Archie Simpson?
 

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

CHrisB

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2003, 06:38:03 PM »
Jim,
Absolutely right--isn't Serpentine a great name for a golf hole?  It is named after the Serpentine Burn which crosses the fairway.  And that is the course designer Archie Simpson teeing off in picture #2 (I love that tee box!).

Try to get your friend's thoughts (or have him post himself) about the hole and the course.  I'll come back with mine a little later when I have more time to post.  Murcar might be worth seeing just for this hole alone, but there is plenty of good golf there.

Can any others who have played it share their thoughts?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:02 PM by -1 »

paul westland

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2003, 06:40:36 PM »
Hey there Chris!  Great post!  I will be there 1 April and hope to play Murcar's sibling the day before. Royal Aberdeen, and Murcar seem to me a wicked good pair!  Montrose is on the calender as well... any thoughts?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Dan Grossman

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2003, 06:48:59 PM »
Chris - When was the above picture taken?

When I played there in August of 2001, the right side was much less playable than this picture (appears).  If one missed the fairway when I was there, the golf ball was likely unplayable and unfindable.

Murcar was fantastic and I actually liked it a bit better than its neighbor, Royal Aberdeen.  I liked #3, with the green at the bottom of a sand pit.  

Paul Y - Montrose is a fun course, but not in the same caliber of course as Royal Aberdeen and Murcar.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Gene Greco

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2003, 08:01:32 PM »
This hole looks sooo much like the 9th at Maidstone sans burn. Maidstone is ten years OLDER so I wonder if it might be possible to have had a reverse influence?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"...I don't believe it is impossible to build a modern course as good as Pine Valley.  To me, Sand Hills is just as good as Pine Valley..."    TOM DOAK  November 6th, 2010

ForkaB

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2003, 03:27:27 AM »
Great pic and pick, Chris!

I've only played Murcar once, nearly 20 years ago, but I do remember that hole.  I think I almost killed a driver into a 2-club wind and then had to hit a 4-iron to the uphill green.  One of my fellow competitiors was a world-class shinty player with unbelievably strong wrists and a multiple Club Champion and North-East District player, and I think he hit a 7-iron in.  Today, with all this new technology, I might think 7-iron for my second, and the other guy a lob wedge.....Nah!  The game is esaier these days, but not that easy!

Great course and great hole.  The former is probably underrated as it is less "posh" than Royal Aberdeen.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Tom Doak

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2003, 01:56:54 PM »
Gene,

They may have been playing golf at Maidstone in 1899, but the ninth hole (and many others) were a product of Willie Park's redesign of 1922-24.

Don't know if Willie Park had ever played Murcar.  Certainly, though, the burn at Murcar is a significant difference between the holes.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

neil regan

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2003, 02:28:22 PM »
Maybe you all know the story they tell at Aberdeen and Murcar, about the visitors who got lost on a quiet day. They started at Aberdeen #1, played down the coast, and at the tenth tee instead of turning inland (a blind tee shot)continued straight onto Murcar #4. A few hours later, they searched in vain for their car in the Murcar car park, also wondering why there were more than 18 holes on the course.
   That stretch of golf, Aberdeen 1-9-Murcar 4-18, would definitely qualify as one of the absolute best links in the world.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Joel_Stewart

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2003, 04:29:01 PM »
The photo with Simpson shows a massive bunker on the right side of the fairway but it appears to be gone in the first photo.  Is this just the light or angle or have they let the bunker fade away?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Brian_Ewen

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2003, 10:07:36 PM »
Neil
I wonder how much truth there is in this story . I played at Royal Aberdeen with a member and he told the same story but it was a busload of japanese tourists , who were amazed that a course would have two clubhouses .

Sounds like a myth to me .

Nice Pic Chris .

Brian Ewen
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:02 PM by -1 »

Neil Regan

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Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2003, 10:25:29 PM »
Brian,
  I suspect it's a legend, but I have been tempted to play it that way. Did you play Murcar ? Don't you think the combination would be great ? It could be the first out-and-never back routing. :)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Tommy_Naccarato

Re: Can you identify one of the world's great par
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2003, 10:39:06 PM »
Great! Here is another course I should have checked out in 96'!

I'll be back.

The picture(s) are amazing!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

SPDB

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Re:Can you identify one of the world's great par 4's?
« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2006, 01:33:51 PM »
Here is #7 at Murcar ("Serpentine") in a recent shot. The hole appears to have changed dramatically from both an aesthetic and strategic perspective. The exposed dune on the right is now a lateral hazard and appears quite boggy (perhaps a function of dune erosion), and the large hill (which really doesn't affect play on the hole) is covered in whins. Nevertheless, it is still in your best interest to negotiate the righthand side for a view into the green. Still a terrific hole, and one of the few at Murcar where you can actually see your ball land!



After having seen the picture prior, and now having seen it on the front of the scorecard, I've been curious if that is a train in the left side of the picture?
« Last Edit: August 21, 2006, 01:58:38 PM by SPDB »

Doug Wright

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Re:Can you identify one of the world's great par 4's?
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2006, 01:45:15 PM »
Chris,

I played both Murcar and Royal Aberdeen the same day last October. Serpentine played downwind and therefore wasn't too challenging as I recall--into the wind both it and the preceding par 4 6th would be brutes. I wouldn't call Serpentine "one of the world's great par 4s" though.

I liked Murcar a lot but I thought there were some very average holes too including the finishers on both the front and back nines. I preferred Royal Aberdeen (and Cruden Bay to the north over both of them) but would play Murcar again in a heartbeat.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2006, 01:47:30 PM by Doug Wright »
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