[Brad Klein]

Golfweek.com July 18, 2001, just posted an exclusive story we wrote about changes in progress at Augusta National, including complete aerial photos of:

-new back tees on 1, 7, 8, 10, 11, 14, 18

-reshaped bunkers on 1, 8, 18

-completely regraded landing areas on 8th, 11th and 18th fairways.

Interested to see what people think about these changes, which could add up to 115 yards.

Augutsa looks like a ar zone. Photos are much more detailed than anaything that ran in GolfWorld.

[Kevin R]

They want to add 30 yds to the 13th?  Why in God's name would they need to do that?

[THuckaby2]

My take is they've already painted so many mustaches on this Mona Lisa, why NOT f*ck up what many call the greatest strategic hole on earth?

Interesting though, from the looks of things the new tee (if the land is acquired) would require a tee shot OVER the right side of the 12th green.  That alone would make things unique....

TH

[Mike_Cirba]

Tom Huckaby;

Why the 13th is only the greatest living hole on earth as designed by those over-rated past masters.

Why now, of course, the greatest living architect in the world is going to show us what COULD have been if only those poor, indigent architects of the Golden Age had access to earth-moving equipment and better technology!  As they used to say during the intro of "The Six-Million Dollar Man", "we can make it better!".  

Now we'll have ourselves a real SIGNATURE golf course we can be proud of by an architect that modern players have heard of!!  

[THuckaby2]

Aw hell Mike, they're all dead anyway.  I heard that MacKenzie guy really was a whacko too.

This is really depressing.

In the spirit of this, can't they cut down the trees behind #12 tee and make that 75-100 yards longer?  I mean really, how challenging is any 155 yard shot these days?  I'm sure that's what MacKenzie really intended anyway.

TH

[Mike_Cirba]

Hell yes, Tom, and while he's at it, perhaps damming up Rae's Creek to create a large pond and waterfall would complete the challenging, new 200+ yard 12th!

Depressing?  You want depressing?

You should accompany me on my lunchtime drive in a certain old money neighborhood here.  

After seeing that, pics of Augusta under the knife wouldn't even make you flinch.

[helper]

here's a link to the photos:

http://www.golfweek.com/articles/2001/pro/majors/men/masters/23365.asp

[Chris_Clouser]

The only one of any of those changes that even looks appealing is the reshaping of the bunker on 8.  Outside of that, they are just adding length for the sake of adding length.  I would like to see the bunkers on 18 though.  Why add yardage to the most difficult hole (11)?  Why add yardage to a hole that everybody lays up on so they can hit a full wedge shot on?  People are still going to hit irons off the tee in most cases.  I don't get it.  Why don't they just move the Masters to one of Fazio's courses and save all of us the agony of seeing Augusta tore up once again.

[Chris_Clouser]

Just found this article.  How many of these suggestions did they implement.  1 or 2 at max.
http://www.golfweek.com/articles/2001/pro/majors/men/masters/21358.asp

[Jealous]

One Fazio Associate B.B. Traveled from Augusta to Pinehurst (Forrest Creek Adding 2nd 18) for a day before he went on to do work at Cypress Point.

Good Work if you can get it!!

[Patrick_Mucci]

Well fellows, I just finished puting my helmet and flak jacket on, so I'm ready for all comers.

I think the lengthening of the 13th hole by
30 yards will improve the hole for the pros.
The hole will remain unchanged for the members tees.

Just go back and look at old footage of how the hole was played 20-30-40 and 50 years ago.  Look where the pros drives ended up, leaving them 3 woods if they were going for the green in two.  What's wrong with bringing them back, making it more difficult to get around the corner, and forcing them to think carefully about laying up their second shot or going for it.  I think it is a very positive change for the pros and the Masters, in that it brings the hole back to how it was intended to be played.

Okay, who's first ?

[Kevin R]

Fred Couples' "Oh baby" shot was hit with a 3 iron.

Nick Faldo's shot to the green in his duel with Greg Norman was with a 2 iron.

David Duval put a long iron into the creek this year.

The hole has always played among the easiest at Augusta in relation to par. From 1942-2000 the field averaged 4.74 on the hole, ranking it the second easiest hole. So it hasn't become a pushover recently. In 1974 the field averaged 4.56.

I don't think any of the above shots would have been more exciting or interesting with a 3 wood or 5 wood in the hands of the player.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Kevin R,

What grass was on the greens from 1942 to 1970 ?

What would you say they averaged on the stimp

Is it easier or harder to pitch to slow greens versus lightening fast greens?

[cross-hander]

Why are we even discussing this? We see the golf course for 8 hours a year that is only played for 4 days. If you ever get on this course you will play from the member's tee's that EVERYONE else plays from. So what if they make the 10th 700 yards and extend the bunker to the green, you will never play that hole. You might play at ANGC but you will not play THAT hole. If Hootie and Co. want the winner to be at E then let them. It is THEIR tournament.

[THuckaby2]

Actually I think each of Pat Mucci and cross-hander make valid points here.  It just sort of gauls me to tamper at all with the really great holes, and #13 at least to me falls in this category.  Yes, it might make competitive sense to push it back, and yes, god knows none of us would ever play the back tee, but still, messing with it at all just bothers me.

If competitive fairness - ie getting the same clubs in one's hands now as years ago - is all that matters, then push every single great hole on earth back 20-50 yards.  Do we really want to do this?  I know this is stretching the point, Pat... but I guess the next thing would be to create a new island and push 18 tee at Pebble back 50 yards... move the Road Hole tee back.... you see where I'm going.  Yes, it all does make logical sense, but it's really depressing and irksome.

TH

[THuckaby2]

I crack myself up with my hasty typing of my internal verbalizations.... I guess I have my old Latin class on the brain... Omnia galia est...  All of Gaul is....

It galls me that I still think of Gaul.

TH

[Father Painswick]

Young Thomas

20 years later and you still have forgotten your Caesar!  "Omnia Gallia in tres partes divisa est...." is how it goes.  I shall think of you during the evening flaggellations.

[THuckaby2]

THAT'S IT!

Caesar's Gallic Wars.  Ahh, the memories.  But please forgive me, Father, it has been 24 years.

All of Gaul sure is divided into three freakin' parts.  

TH

[Taylor Anderson]

It's funny that this comes up now because I was just about to ask about short par fives. I can't think of any new course that has incorporated an interesting short par 5 into the layout. Almost new par 5's are a good 500+ yards from the white tees and you never see a 485 par 5 from the blues. I love to see these guys because you know that there will be a decision to be made on both the tee and second shot. I love the 13th at Augusta for my playing ability. (I've played it over and over in my head anyway.) Maybe for the pros it needs the length, but I don't see changing it for the sake of changing it. If they're so concerned about the winning score, make it a par 4 and, by default, the most difficult hole on the course. Has anyone got an answer to "why?"

[Patrick_Mucci]

Tom, Kevin, et. al.,

Why didn't it bother anyone when the Old Course at St. Andrews was lengthened over the last 50 years ?

[THuckaby2]

It hasn't bothered me because they haven't touched the Road Hole, the one hole there I hold sacred.  You'll notice I could give a fig what they do to the other holes at Augusta they mentioned... just don't touch 12 or 13.  Of course I rather they not mess with any holes, but they do what they have to do.  Just don't mess with the sacred ones...

TH

[Mike_Cirba]

Patrick;

It DID bother me when new tees were created for the last Open at The Old Course.  A lot..

Did they help in any way?  I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who would say that those changes improved the course our tournament in any real way.  

[Patrick_Mucci]

Tom Huckaby,

I would agree with you on # 12, but think the added length at # 13 will enhance the hole.

[THuckaby2]

Patrick, I guess I can live with that.  It would hurt a little as I am so "used" to 13 at its present yardage, but I can definitely see your point.

Can we throttle back the golf ball instead?

TH

[Patrick_Mucci]

Mike Cirba,

When Daly was winning the British Open, Nicklaus was commenting on how he would play the hole.  Daly's play was quite different, he flew most of the bunkers.

On Today's Open telecast one announcer mentioned how Woods was never in a bunker at
TOC, because he flew most of them.

The immediate stop gap weapon is to lengthen the course, the ultimate stop gap weapon is to limit the ball, but no one wants to wait for that.

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