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aclayman

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #25 on: July 20, 2001, 06:15:00 AM »
TEPaul- was that a right or a left at the stateline? I'm there, great idea.

It is interesting to hear about these fears.
And I agree wholeheartedly with the esteemed deputy Fife and that is why this ignorant voice has never even considered piping down.


john f

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #26 on: July 20, 2001, 10:24:00 AM »
In the few years I've been posting/lurking, this is w/out a doubt the best. We need more & more "Pizza Men" to show thier stuff!

Scott_Burroughs

  • Karma: +0/-0
GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #27 on: July 20, 2001, 11:25:00 AM »
The Pizza Man was seeking autographs from the GCA rock stars.  I'm just a lowly garage band using instruments found at yard sales.

"I am just a Bill.  A lonely old Bill.  And I'm sitting here on Capitol Hill..."  


Lisa Luigs Morrissett

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #28 on: July 21, 2001, 01:13:00 AM »
Scott - maybe you'll be a law someday. . .

The Pizza Man is my new hero (sorry John and Ran) and has revived my interest in this discussion group as the other topics haven't exactly captured my attention. PIZZA MAN RULES!

Either that, or I am logged on at 4 a.m. being pregnant and awake with what must be a future soccer girl and not a Girls' Junior champion. . .


Patrick_Mucci

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #29 on: July 21, 2001, 05:29:00 AM »
Lisa,

It's a well known medical fact that most mothers to be, incorrectly diagnose and associate kicking with soccer and football, not understanding that your little angel is just trying to take a wider stance, and you are impeding play.

Good Luck !!!!!!!!


ForkaB

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #30 on: July 21, 2001, 10:57:00 AM »
Lisa (and John)

Congratulations!

PS--sat in the Morrisset bench a few times last month, and the setting is beautiful and peaceful and a very good place for communing with nature and learning about what golf and life should be.

PPS--my 8-year old, who hit a massive 77-yard drive on our holiday, and is now an associate member at our club (for the sum of 8 pounds/year) will keep all the Junior Girls trophies safe and clean, first for her 3-year old sister, and then for your daughter when she comes of age.

All the best.


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #31 on: July 21, 2001, 12:22:00 PM »
Far be it for me to disagree with a pregnant women, especially one that could probably spot me two a side while in the throes of labor and still kick my butt.<P>However, although the Pizza story is awfully amusing, I think it is a mistake to encourage everyone lurking to post. <P>Is that elitist? Yes, but like it or not, this is an elitist website with a high level of discussion. Not economically - as implied above - but certainly intellectually. The main allure to logging on here so often, is that this ongoing discussion and exploration of golf is a forum to teach each other - and maybe even to force ourselves to really examine our opinions and beliefs. <P>It is one thing to simply “think” something, and quite another to articulate it to other learned posters and solicit comment.<P>Maybe the Pizza man has nothing relevant to add, and maybe he does, but in every University, there are always more students than teachers. <P>That does not mean that students cannot participate in a limited capacity - raising questions and so forth, but that hardly means they ought to barge into the faculty lounge and expound their theories either.<P>Yes, there are plenty of lurkers who would add a fresh voice to the threads and again, perhaps the Pizza man is one of those people. The beauty of this site is that everyone - be they electrician, attorney or golf bum, is perceived on the basis of the insight of their posts.<P>That said, the minute you start inviting everyone into the Treehouse, you risk diluting the level of exchange. Some people are too intimidated to post because they feel they have nothing new to add, and are just satisfied to read and learn. In many cases that is probably best.<P><BR>If they grow to truly love golf architecture and it stimulates them to read and learn the subject thoroughly enough to participate, that is great. But until then, a little bit of intimidation serves us well to keep out the poseurs. <P>I for one, appreciate that the vast majority of posts are cogent and do not wish to waste time wading through a bunch of half-baked comments. <P>Maybe Ran and John ought to start a separate site for the uninitiated to get their feet wet. Golf Architecture 101 - Freshman Seminar. . . .  I guess that isn’t nice, is it?   <P>That stated, before we undertake some egalitarian experiment to make GCA “all-inclusive,” remember why we gather here in the first place.<P>Your thoughts Mr. Pizza man?<P>P.S. Please don't post under that moniker. I believe everyone ought to use their real names - the ability to hide behind anonymity is what has poisoned much of the internet. Seeing your name attached to your words tends to give you more of a sense of owning what you say.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 02:47:18 PM by Gib Papazian »

Slag_Bandoon

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #32 on: July 21, 2001, 01:40:00 PM »
  Gib, we are all poseurs.  We don't all have the gift of Gib but we all have our perspectives - intellectual or pseudo so. The illusory loft of intellectual luxury is an ego-driven sham.
  Sometimes I chime in for the soul purpose of speaking for the hacks and ignorant. I'm one myself so I'm highly qualified.  

 Inviting people to speak up does not make for a riot. It shows trust that we have faith in them. Self-editing due to self doubt is psychocensorship.

 Vox Populi PizzaMan Vici!    


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #33 on: July 21, 2001, 02:55:00 PM »
Puhhhhleeeeze Slag.

"The illusive loft of intellectual luxury is an ego driven sham."

Poppycock, and you know it.

Perhaps you fancy yourself a spokesman for the "hacks and ignorant," but your plaintive cry that you somehow share a kinship with them is frankly ridiculous.

I have read enough of your posts to know for certain that you are an extraordinarily intelligent man, but perhaps one that has not fully come to grips with the importance of what we have here at GCA.

We are not simply exchanging information in the Treehouse - that would grow tiresome very quickly - what we are REALLY doing is tickling each other's brains.

In reality, GCA is an intellectual exercise, an activity that is clearly not for everyone.

In the real world, it is almost impossible to get 100 thoughtful answers exploring a given subject, do you REALLY believe that the vast majority of golfers in the world have ever thought this hard about the game?

A better question might be: "Have the vast majority of people in the world ever thought through ANYTHING as throughly as we do these subjects?"


You write:
"Inviting people to speak up does not make for a riot. It shows trust that we have faith in them."

Maybe you ought to trust them to chime in when they are comfortable with their general knowledge to engage in a conversation that is not out of their depth.

They'll know when that time is.


Patrick_Mucci

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #34 on: July 21, 2001, 05:17:00 PM »
Gib is correct.

If you want to dilute the quality of the posts, open up the flood gates to everyone.


Peter Galea

  • Karma: +0/-0
GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2001, 05:57:00 PM »
Gib and Patrick,
This may ruffle some feathers, but at the top of the DG page it states:

New Topics: Any visitors (including unregistered) may post new topics in this
forum.

Replies: Any visitors (including unregistered) may post replies in this forum.

Some of the late-comers have made brilliant posts. When does the membershp close?

"chief sherpa"

TEPaul

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2001, 06:16:00 PM »
I don't think any of us should want to limit participation and contribution on this website.

But I think all of us, the older and more regular contributors, and the new ones and those that may be lurkers and hopefully will contribute should understand that basically it would be a good thing for all of us and for this site if we generally keep things and the overall discussion concentrating on educational and good information to do with archtiecture.

There's always the opportunity to have fun and joke around but the concentration should be on anything and everything that is educational and apropos to golf course architecture. That way this can continue to be the great resource for all that is has been.


John_D._Bernhardt

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #37 on: July 21, 2001, 06:37:00 PM »
Maybe thats why our golf is weak in Louisiana.  I am having trouble getting our greens chairman and distict attorney to read this site. Yet you guys have a pizza guy chatting Donald Ross. Hell I play with a Donald P.Ross, and cannot get him on here.

ForkaB

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #38 on: July 21, 2001, 10:50:00 PM »
Pizza Guy, et. al.

I'm with Slag and Pete on this one.  This always has been and always should be an open site.  It is one of its great virtues and assests that new people seem to join and post almost every day.  ALL of us who post have limited perspectives and experiences and can learn from others with differing points of view and backgrounds.

Lurk if you want to, post if you want to, but above all, enjoy!


Slag_Bandoon

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #39 on: July 22, 2001, 12:17:00 AM »
  Gib, I've tried to restrain myself from perpetuating this debate, but reading your initial post is disturbing to me. Not only is the intent negative, (in the guise of logic) the content is porous. This is NOT an elitIST site! It is an ELITE site. The only site I've found with the spectrum of minds that keep me interested and involved on a regular basis. Fresh minds add variety...hmmm...what we crave on golfing grounds.  
Knowledge has a saturation point. One day we all come to realize that the more we know, the more we don't know.  

 I guess what really troubles me is your enigmatic underlying motive.  This post was gingerly bouncing along when all of a sudden..schlinggh!!! concertina and razor wire.
 
  A few weeks ago, you opened up with mention of how much you loved America and how your ancestors escaped oppression and came over with nothing but dreams. Have you forgotten that?

PizzaMan Rawks!!!  Anchovies are Golden Age Design!

"Forgive them Father for they know not what they've done."  Jesus H. Christ

Lisa, I hear lots of Greens are good for mothers-to-be.     (oy)

BarneyF, Nice post and punchline.


Paul Turner

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #40 on: July 22, 2001, 03:28:00 AM »
I'm with Slag on this one, there's been plenty of posts with no relevance to GCA from the stalwarts of this site.

And Gib, I remember you posting a similar line of thinking sime time ago; but you had the good sense to rethink and apologise for it then.


Patrick_Mucci

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #41 on: July 22, 2001, 05:01:00 AM »
Slag, Pete, Rich, Paul,

You need to brush up on your reading comprehension.  

If you accurately read, and understood Gib's post, he said, " I think it is a mistake to
ENCOURAGE EVERYONE LURKING TO POST."

He didn't say they shouldn't post.
He didn't say it's a closed forum.

He said, he thought it was a mistake to encourage EVERYONE lurking to post.

Do you agree that doing so would dilute the quality of the threads and site.

Perhaps you were overserved last night.  


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #42 on: July 22, 2001, 06:28:00 AM »
Patrick, you beat me to it.

Sorry Slag, your logic still doesn't wash, but I'll give you points for:

"This post was gingerly bouncing along when all of a sudden..schlinggh!!! concertina and razor wire."

If you are going to pawn yourself off as one of the "hacks and ignorant," try to be a trifle less erudite.

Again, Patrick hit it on the head. All I am suggesting is that there is no reason to compel every lurker to post something.

What is the point of prodding an 18 handicapper into playing the Black Markers until he is ready?

And make no mistake, this website is the Black Tees of golf analysis.

Fresh voices are good - but not every voice adds something.

In examining my previous posts, there is NOTHING THAT SUGGESTS WE BAR ANYONE FROM POSTING.

It has nothing to do with how much I love America either . . . jeez, what a stretch that is.

I like to play guitar, and I'm pretty decent, but does that mean I should feel comfortable sitting in with Eric Clapton?
I'd just end up annoying him with my amateurish chops. In other words, I have nothing to add and know it.

Rich Goodale,
You're another one! It is all well and good to encourage new posters - and I do not disagree - but coming from you, that is like Mike Tyson inviting everyone to climb into the ring.

Intimidation? Heck, your blindingly intelligent posts are half the reason!


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #43 on: July 22, 2001, 06:48:00 AM »
BTW,

This kind of ping pong is great fun, even if it has nothing to do with golf architecture.


ForkaB

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #44 on: July 22, 2001, 07:25:00 AM »
......Rich Goodale posted 07-22-2001 02:50 AM ET (US), in part:

"Lurk if you want to, post if you want to, but above all, enjoy!"

He was actually surprisingly sober just having returned from "Kids Night" at the San Francisco Zoo with 3 other parents and 4 children 8 and under, including Melissa McRoberts Goodale, age 3, who is the only Goodale capable of intimidating Mike Tyson, and will probably blow me off this site once she masters the GCA search engine, and.....

...there has been more than one lurker/semi-lurker who has written me privately in the past and expressed concern about participating on this site because he or she was unable to contribute to the debate on whether Somerset Hills or Plainfield was the 4th best course in New Jersey, or whether the 18th at TOC was a golf hole or a mislabeled cricket pitch that needed to get up close and personal with a D-9, but.....

.....I have always encouraged them to post, and I think the site would be far less rich if more than one of them had not taken my advice, so....

.....now, let's enjoy the amazing golf that may or may not be on your TV, and.....

....I for one am glad that I didn't post my thoughts on what I thought these guys would do to Lytham and very glad that am being proved horribly, horribly wrong!

What a Golf Course!!!!!!!


Slag_Bandoon

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #45 on: July 22, 2001, 10:19:00 AM »
  Gib, You are entitled to your own wrong opinion.  
 Are you practicing up for an editing position?
 I agree that every thought should not be posted, (perhaps this is one), but to discourage a person from taking the plunge by filling their heads with self-doubt and questionable worthiness is a corrosive direction. Republican-like.

Pro Bono Bandoon

Ed, I'd be honored to have your autograph as well.   hmmm... I wonder what an Ed Baker signed Titleist hat would go for on eBay. Naw, I'd keep it. I wouldn't know how to handle myself if I became rich.

Well, Jerry Springer's on, gotta go see what MY people are up to. Gollyjeewillickers! Tom Fazio is having a tryst with Tammy Fay. He must admire all that natural beauty.


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #46 on: July 22, 2001, 11:04:00 AM »
Slag,

Oh spare me that "equality now," and "power to the people" rap.

I have encouraged several regular posters on this site who were previously too intimidated to post.

But this psychological barrier also keeps many participants from spewing thoughtlessly.    

Corrosive? Republican-like? Nothing has damaged society more than extrapolating the idea of "inclusion" beyond all sense and reason.

And Slag, what could possibly be the point of dragging politics into this discussion?

Besides, I'm not a Republican, only a great believer in common sense, something apparently lost as we blindly march off the egalitarian cliff.

Say hi to Barb Boxer for me at the next fundraiser . . . . . :-)  


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #47 on: July 22, 2001, 11:05:00 AM »
Slag,

Oh spare me that "equality now," and "power to the people" rap.

I have encouraged several regular posters on this site who were previously too intimidated to post.

But this psychological barrier also keeps many participants from spewing thoughtlessly.    

Corrosive? Republican-like? Nothing has damaged society more than extrapolating the idea of "inclusion" beyond all sense and reason.

And Slag, what could possibly be the point of dragging politics into this discussion?

Besides, I'm not a Republican, only a great believer in common sense, something apparently lost as we blindly march off the egalitarian cliff.

Say hi to Barb Boxer for me at the next fundraiser . . . . . :-)  


Slag_Bandoon

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #48 on: July 22, 2001, 11:47:00 AM »
Oooooh... Double post. What's that worth? About 7 exclamation points?

Our polarity on this is reaching the antipodes and I don't want to start 'spewing thoughtlessly' just to get in the last word.

  But, 'Psychological barrier' is a term that you'll never get any agreement with from this kid.  How about 'Respectful parlance' instead?  

Give $ to Barbara Boxer? A Callyfornyun? I'd rather give to the WTO. (And that aint gonna happen.)

 


Gib_Papazian

GCA and the Pizza Man! The Silent Majority?
« Reply #49 on: July 22, 2001, 12:40:00 PM »
 . . . . . hee hee

okay Slag . . . .uncle.